THE NEXT PRESIDENT. I THINK ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN. I TRULY DO. LEGENDARY JOURNALIST BOB WOODWARD. OUR NEW INTERVIEW IN BATTLEGROUND WISCONSIN, THE TRUMP TAPES. YOU DON’T UNDERSTAND ME, BUT THAT’S OKAY. THE BIDEN REELECTION, WE’VE GOT IT ALL. NEW PRISON PLAN. HE’S CONCERNED. I’M CONCERNED. SWEEPING CHANGES ANNOUNCED BY THE GOVERNOR AND THE DEPARTMENT OF CORRECTIONS, OVERCROWDING, LOCKDOWNS, STAFFING SHORTAGES AT BOTH WEAPON AND GREEN BAY CORRECTIONAL ALLOWAY VILLAGE PRESIDENT JIM RAFTER IS HERE. HIS DEMANDS TO SHUT IT DOWN. A FEDERAL CRACKDOWN ON. WE HAVE BEEN PELTING THE MARKETPLACE WITH ENFORCEMENT AND COMPLIANCE ACTIONS. THE FDA PROMISING EVEN MORE ENFORCEMENT TARGETING UNDERAGE TOBACCO USE AS NEW WISCONSIN NUMBERS ARE JUST OUT. BRIAN KING, DIRECTOR OF THE FDA CENTER FOR TOBACCO PRODUCTS, WITH THE NEW ACTION MOMENTS AWAY AND HIGH DRAMA ON THE HIGH COURT. EVERYBODY KNOWS THAT THE REASON WE’RE HERE IS BECAUSE THERE WAS A CHANGE IN THE MEMBERSHIP OF THE COURT INSIDE THE HIGH STAKES ARGUMENTS. WILL JUSTICES DECLARE THE STATE’S MAPS UNCONSTITUTIONAL? ALL THIS IS UPFRONT WITH GERRON JORDAN AND POLITICAL DIRECTOR MATT SMITH. HI, EVERYONE. HOPE YOU’RE HAVING A GOOD HOLIDAY WEEKEND. ABOUT A WEEK TO GO UNTIL THE NEXT REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL PRIMARY DEBATE AND THE FIELD IS NARROWING. THE NEXT DEBATE TAKING PLACE DECEMBER 6TH IN TUSCALOOSA, ALABAMA, TO QUALIFY, CANDIDATES MUST NOW HIT AT LEAST 6% IN CERTAIN POLLING CRITERIA AND HAVE AT LEAST 80,000 DONORS. FORMER PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP, WHO MAINTAINS A DOMINANT LEAD IN THE POLLS, IS AGAIN EXPECTED TO BE A NO SHOW. ALL THIS AS VOTERS NATIONWIDE AND IN WISCONSIN DO NOT SEEM THRILLED WITH THE POTENTIAL FOR A TRUMP BIDEN REMATCH. AND IT’S A GOOD PLACE TO BEGIN. OUR NEW INTERVIEW WITH BOB WOODWARD. WELL, YOU’RE NICE TO DO THIS. WOULD HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS AND WITH THAT, WE WERE OFF. BOB WOODWARD AT UW MILWAUKEE’S WAUKESHA CAMPUS EARLIER THIS MONTH SPEAKING TO A SOLD OUT CROWD. AND BEFORE THAT, SPENDING ABOUT 30 MINUTES WITH A SMALL GROUP OF REPORTERS, INCLUDING UPFRONT, WAS. WHAT INTERESTS ME IS, IS HOW IMPORTANT THE COMING YEAR IS IN POLITICS. FOREIGN RELATIONS, THE CULTURE OF THE COUNTRY, THE DIVISION AS WOODWARD AS HE PUT IT, HAS SPENT THE PAST SEVEN YEARS WRITING ABOUT AND INTERVIEWING FORMER PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP. TRUMP HAS BEEN A JOLT TO THE POLITICAL SYSTEM AND CONTINUES TO BE. I SPENT THE LAST SEVEN YEARS OF MY LIFE ON HIM WRITING THREE BOOKS AND AN AUDIO BOOK WHICH WE HAD INTERVIEWED HIM FOR FOR EIGHT HOURS THE LAST YEAR OF HIS PRESIDENCY. HE AGREED TO DO THAT. SO MY WIFE, ELSA, WHO WHO EDITS MY BOOKS AND IS VERY INVOLVED, INVOLVED. SO WE WOULD BE AT HOME THAT YEAR AND THE PHONE WOULD RING AND WE WOULD THINK, IS IT ONE OF OUR TWO DAUGHTERS? IS IT A FRIEND? IS IT A ROBOCALL OR IS IT DONALD TRUMP? AND IT WOULD OFTEN BE DONALD TRUMP. YOU DON’T UNDERSTAND ME. BUT THAT’S OKAY. YOU’LL UNDERSTAND ME AFTER THE ELECTION. BUT YOU DON’T UNDERSTAND ME NOW. A YEAR AGO, WOODWARD RELEASED THE TRUMP TAPES, AN AUDIOBOOK FEATURING WOODWARD’S 20 INTERVIEWS WITH TRUMP TAKING PLACE IN 2019 AND 2020. IN THE MIDST OF THE COVID 19 PANDEMIC AND AHEAD OF THE 2020 ELECTION. I’M SO BUSY, BOB, I DON’T HAVE TIME TO BREATHE. WHAT’S UP, BOB? OKAY. I WANTED TO KIND OF GET AN OVERVIEW OF EVERYTHING THAT HAS BEEN GOING ON. OKAY. I’VE JUST GOT SOME VERY GOOD POLL NUMBERS. I WILL SAY THAT I RECORDER ON FOR OUR HISTORY HERE. THIS IS OUR 17TH CONVERSATION FOR THIS BOOK. WOW. AND AND THAT’S A LOT. I’VE TAKEN A LOT OF YOUR TIME. YEAH, WELL, ALL I ASK FOR IS FAIRNESS. AND, YOU KNOW, I’M SURE I WON’T GET IT, BUT THAT’S OKAY. WELL, I’M USED TO THAT. BUT I DO ASK FOR FAIRNESS BECAUSE NOBODY’S DONE WHAT I’VE DONE. NOBODY. TRUMP IS NOW SUING OVER THE RELEASE, ARGUING THE INTERVIEWS WERE RELEASED WITHOUT HIS PERMISSION. A LAWSUIT. WOODWARD AND HIS ATTORNEYS ARE ASKING TO BE DISMISSED. YOU RELEASED THE AUDIO TAPES. THE FORMER PRESIDENT SUED YOU OVER. THAT. WHAT DID YOU WANT? THE AMERICAN PUBLIC TO TO HEAR FROM THAT? WELL, YOU KNOW, HEAR HIM. IT’S IN HIS OWN VOICE WITH A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT WHAT’S GOING ON, PARTICULARLY WITH THE CORONAVIRUS. YOU KNOW, IN STRIVING TO FIND OUT WHAT HAPPENED AND WHO PEOPLE ARE HAVING THEIR OWN VOICE AND WHAT THEY SAY FOR HOURS AND HOURS AND HOURS, TAKE YOU AS CLOSE AS YOU’RE GOING TO GET TO WHO SOMEBODY IS. IS HE STILL IS HE STILL CALLING, YOU KNOW, I’M NOT ON HIS CALL LIST. HE, AS YOU SAID, IS SUING THIS, SUING ME. AND THE PUBLISHER. AN ALLEGED COPY WRITE VIOLATION AND THAT’S A LITTLE CONFOUNDING TO ME BECAUSE THERE’S A PUBLIC OFFICIALS WORDS OR PUBLIC PROPERTY. WOODWARD’S FIRST PULITZER CAME FROM HIS REPORTING ON WATERGATE ALONGSIDE WASHINGTON POST REPORTER CARL BERNSTEIN, WHICH LED TO THE EVENTUAL RESIGNATION OF PRESIDENT RICHARD NIXON. THE THE SIMILARITIES BETWEEN THEN TRUMP AND NIXON ARE IMMENSE. THEY’RE DIFFERENT. BUT THERE ARE A LOT OF SIMILARITIES. BUT ONE OF THE THEMES IS, IS POLITICAL HATE THAT NIXON EMBODIED TRUMP IS EMBODIED. AND WE NOW SEE IT ON AN INTERNATIONAL SCALE IN THE MIDDLE EAST AND IN UKRAINE. POLITICAL HATE IS DRIVING A LOT TOO MUCH. IT’S CRIPPLING. WOULD WARD’S NEW BOOK WILL FOCUS ON UKRAINE, THE MIDDLE EAST. THE PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGNS, AND PRESIDENT BIDEN, WHO TURNED 81 THIS PAST WEEK, THE OLDEST PRESIDENT IN US HISTORY. WHAT DOES IT SAY ABOUT THE COUNTRY IF TRUMP IS THE NOMINEE HERE IN MILWAUKEE NEXT SUMMER, IT’S QUITE LIKELY. I THINK IT’S ALL I THINK IT’S YOU KNOW, MAYBE NOT ALWAYS. YOU NEVER CAN TELL SOMEBODY IN THE BIDEN WHITE HOUSE SAID, WELL, IT IT MAY BE NOT TRUMP VERSUS BIDEN, BUT X VERSUS Y. I DON’T KNOW WHO X AND Y MIGHT BE, BUT THAT’S POSSIBLE. SO WE’RE WE’RE IN THIS UNCHARTED TERRITORY. IF YOU RECALL HISTORY, 1968 WAS A YEAR SIMILAR TO THIS COMING A YEAR WAR VIOLENCE PER POLITICS AT AND LYNDON JOHNSON, WHO WAS SITTING PRESIDENT, WITHDREW YOU FROM RUNNING DUE DO YOU KNOW WHEN MARCH. OF 1968. SO THE EQUIVALENT WOULD BE THIS COMING. MARCH 5TH MONTHS AWAY NOT SAYING IT’S GOING TO HAPPEN, BUT IT COULD COULD HAPPEN. YOU HINTED AT THIS WHEN TALKING ABOUT 68. DO YOU THINK THERE IS A SCENARIO WHERE BIDEN’S NAME IS NOT ON THE BALLOT NEXT NOVEMBER? I THINK ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN IN I TRULY DO. AND WOULD YOU SAY THAT IN ANY ELECTION CYCLE. SURE. BUT, YOU KNOW, HE I HAPPEN TO BE HE ED ALSO AND IS NOT 37 OR 40 7 OR 50 7 OR 67 AND PRESIDENCIES HARD AND, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE ARE GOING TO JUDGE. BUT BEFORE DOING THAT, I MEAN, WHAT MY ROLE, I HOPE, IS TO DESCRIBE IT, LEARN AS MUCH ABOUT WHAT’S HAPPENING IN IS 82 OLD TO BE PRESIDENT. BUT I MEAN, IS IT IS 80 TOO OLD TO BE A REPORTER? YEAH. MY WIFE ASKS THAT QUESTION. ALL RIGHT. FASCINATING CONVERSATION. YES, IT IS. THANK YOU FOR BRINGING IT TO US. COMING UP, THE NEW PRISON PLAN. GOVERNOR TONY EVERS RECENTLY UNVEILING THE NEW STEPS. ALLOYS VILLAGE PRESIDENT IS HERE. THE HOME TO GREEN BAY CORRECTIONAL INSTITUTION. HIS DEMANDS AND REACTI